How to Help a Former Catholic, Now Mormon, See that Works Will Not Earn Salvation
Greg and Amy answer a listener’s question: “How can I help a coworker, who’s a former Catholic and now a Mormon, see that the works he does will not earn his salvation?”
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I have another approach to the problem, and there are two parts. Part One concerns the standard. Mr Koukl follows the Ray Comfort strategy of the ten commandments being the standard by which we are judged. I respectfully disagree. In Acts 17 we read "For he [God] has fixed a day on which he will judge the whole world in justice BY THE STANDARD OF A MAN whom he has appointed. That this is so he has guaranteed to all men by raising this man from the dead" (J B Phillips, emphasis mine). I am placed on one pan of God's balances – not my works, what I've done or not done but me myself (like Belshazzar in Daniel 5). And the standard on the other pan of the scales is Jesus Himself. This is wholly fair because Jesus is and eternally remains wholly man. How do I measure up? It's a rhetorical question.
Part 2 follows on. What hope is there when I am up against such a standard? Here's the genius and grace of God. When we are born again we become "in Christ"! "Yet indeed I also count all things loss for the excellence of the knowledge of Christ Jesus my Lord, for whom I have suffered the loss of all things, and count them as rubbish THAT I MAY GAIN CHRIST AND BE FOUND IN HIM, not having my own righteousness, which [is] from the law, but that which [is] through faith in Christ, the righteousness which is from God by faith" (NASB Philippians 3, emphasis mine). The New Testament abounds with the words "in Him" and "in Christ" – it's a worthwhile study. So when Jesus takes his place as the standard on the scales I am "in Him" and have nothing to fear.
Lastly, we should not forget that the sin problem is not a performance problem, it's a nature problem. We aren't sinners because we sin, we sin BECAUSE we are sinners. That's our nature. When a child makes a mess – yes, we have to clear up the mess, but we have to deal with the child so s/he won't do it again. Here, again, is the genius and grace of God – "… seeing that His divine power has granted to us everything pertaining to life and godliness, through the true knowledge of Him who called us by His own glory and excellence. For by these He has granted to us His precious and magnificent promises, so that by them YOU MAY BECOME PARTAKERS OF THE DIVINE NATURE, having escaped the corruption that is in the world by lust". That change comes about by being born again, born into God's family.
The Cross, the Resurrection and the New Birth are the complete solution to the sin problem. "Works" just don't enter into it.
the worst Catholics convert to protestantism, the best protestants convert to Catholicism
Grace alone
Here’s univocal: “You see that man is justified by works and not by faith alone.” – James 2:24
I pray for this person that left Catholic Church to come back to the church Jesus Christ founded.
Catholic Church is the church Jesus Christ founded
Absolutely not:
Through Christ, God gave us back the divine life mankind lost in its fall. Hence the divine healing miracles and casting out of demons, we experience up to this day.
To not see God in Christ…. is impossible.
"The Father and I are one!"
"If you see Me, you see the Father!"
"Don't you believe that the Father is IN Me?"
"ALL (!) AUTHORITY in heaven and earth has been given to Me!". (Only God has all authority).
At healing the paralytic: "Your sins have been forgiven you!" (Only God can forgive sins).
"I am THE (not a) light of the world"……: God.
"I have come to give you Zoë (=divine life) in abundance"…. Only God can give Zoë life.
"I am from above, you are from beneath. You are from this world, I am not from this world"…..
Etc, etc, etc,
When He explained these things, healed the sick, casted out demons, raised the dead, controlled nature for 3 years, they all worshipped Him as God/Messiah…. except for the critical scholars and farisees!
He NEVER said: "Don't worship Me, I am just a prophet!". The Jews wanted to stone Him because: "You claim to be God".
So Jesus is God manifesting in Human form. Period. Glad He did. So now we finally know the sayings and actions of God.
Next step.
To not see Jesus bringing the divine life of the ages back to you-manity…. is impossible.
"I will send Holy Spirit, the same as Me, He will be IN you, guide you into truth and give you explosive power to heal the sick, raise the dead, cast out demons, etc, etc"
"Follow Me, the miracles I do, you will do too"
"God is IN you"
"The Kingdom of God is IN you"
"He who meets you, meets Me".
"You and I are one"
"You will understand that the Father is IN Me and I am in you"
"See, I have given you power over all the forces of the enemy"
"I have come to give you Zoë (=divine life) in abundance!"
Etc, etc, etc.
Hence the divine healing miracles and casting out of demons with His first 12+72 friends.
As i understood these things, i experienced healing miracles and the casting out of demons already thousands of times and many other true believers do too. Yay!
Conclusion of Paul after having revelation and healing all on Malta: "Jesus, the exact image of the invisible God. The fullness of deity dwells in Jesus bodily" and you have been made complete IN Him (the last Adam), who is the head of every principality and power".
John (who had seen, touched, heard Jesus and walked in the same power and love): "the invisible God manifested in human form, in Christ and now in us".
Thomas having revelation saying to Jesus: "My Lord and My God!". Jesus being God did NOT correct Him.
Etc, etc, etc.
His life totally proves He is God in human form. Begotten by the Spirit of God, filled with the spirit of God, healing all, raising the dead, casting out demons, controlling nature, raised from the dead, pouring out His Spirit for us to be indwelled by to be empowered to heal the sick and cast out demons, etc, etc, etc.
Way to much to degrade Him to "just a prophet".
So… Jesus is the manifestation of God in a human body…. "the Son" of God. He came to take the alienation away mankind got trapped in after the fall. He came to give us back the divine life Adam/mankind lost in its fall.
Because of this fall, a perfect Holy sacrifice had to be made. That is what God did in Christ! It shows His deep, pure, affectionate passion from Him to you/His creation, to restore you back to origin: Christlikeness. Walking in divine power and unselfish divine love.
Jesus walked flawless. Muhammed on the other hand….
Muhammed came after Jesus. He unfortunately never understood God's resolve for mankind's fall, wrote another story, called it the only truth, cutting of the real truth, leading millions astray from their godly identity in Christ. Heartbreaking.
But for those who take Jesus for who He is and ask to be filled by His godly Holy Spirit…..: divine life. Tangible presence of God, healings, demons running for cover, etc. Just as with His first 12+72 friends.
God will make you experience the full (godly) Life made possible through Holy Spirit.
So don't be afraid to leave islam. God can only be found in/through Jesus Christ.
Ask Him to fill you with His/God's Holy Spirit so He can guide you into truth and transform your life. You and God/Jesus are finally one again. He will open your eyes and give you Zoë (divine life). You will be growing into Him in all things. The life you see in Him and His first 12+72 friends.
I experience it since 25 years and so will you.
I know this is nit-picky, but the title of the book is "Revelation", not "Revelations". Saying it wrong repeatedly gives the impression of a less than thorough familiarity with the book itself. Just telling you this to give you an opportunity to strengthen your witness.
The Reformers' Gospel says that through faith alone justification we receive Christ' righteousness imputed on or credited to us while our sins, past AND future, imputed on or credited to Christ who bore them on the cross. They call it double imputation. We do NOT become righteous but only legally counted a s righteous and remain sinner. Christ remains sinless while He is legally counted as sinner. Because of this God directed His wrath and anger to sinless Christ, instead of to us and let us enter heaven while still remain in sin. This explains why you believe that (1) you enter heaven based on what Christ did on the cross and not based on anything you do, be they good works or sinful works and (2) you do not need to become righteous, in fact you are told that you cannot become righteous as you always fall short.
Is this teaching scriptural?
Scripture says in Ezekiel 18:20 " the righteousness of the righteous shall be upon himself and the wickedness of the wicked shall be upon himself". This verse denies double imputation of the Reformers – both righteousness and wickedness are NOT transferrable. Ezekiel 33:12 says "the righteous shall NOT be able to live by his righteousness when he sins". This verse denies the Reformers' teaching that we can become justified/righteous (externally) and sinner (internally) at the same time. Scripture says our sins committed after faith do affect our salvation (Heb. 10:24-26). 1 John 3:8 says "he who sins is of the devil". Prov. 17:15 says "he who justifies the wicked and he who condemns the righteous are both alike abomination to the Lord". Compare this with Reformers' teaching that makes God justify us to enter heaven who remain unrighteous and punished sinless Christ for our sins.
Following Scripture Catholics believe through Christ we ARE MADE righteous (Rom. 5:19). We are made righteous through faith as faith is counted as righteousness (Rom. 4:3). According to Scripture righteousness does NOT come from faith only – read Psalms 106:30-31 – 1John 3:7 says "he who does what is right is righteous". Our ability both to have faith and to do what is right comes from and is only possible by grace through Christ as apart from Him we can do nothing (John 15:5). Why becoming righteous is essential for our salvation? Scripture says righteousness delivers from death (Prov. 10:2, 11:3) and the righteous shall go to eternal life (Mat. 25:46). We lose our righteousness through sinning (Ezek. 33:12, cited above). According to Scripture (1 John 5:16-17) there are deadly or mortal sins and non-deadly or venial sins. This is the reason why we need Sacraments, through which our sins are washed away, if we repent, and returns our righteous state back. When we die in righteous state and are judged (Heb. 9:27) we will declared righteous and are therefore entitled to enter heaven because we are indeed (made) righteous. Christ willingly offer Himself to die for our sins because without shedding of blood there is no forgiveness of sin (Heb. 9:22). While Christ died for our sins God did not direct His anger and wrath to Him. We enter heaven based on what Christ did on the cross AND what He does in us, i.e. He transform us from our unrighteous state to righteous state.
There is an error in the question and another in the attitude. The error in the question is that those who preach "work" never claim that one's work 'earns' one salvation. It is a different claim they make. Not doing work when you can prevents you from entering the kingdom. It is a different claim. All Christians believe salvation is a gift of Grace and that we cannot earn it period.
The error in attitude is worse. Why on God's earth do you want or even think you want to put a spanner in the gears of someone trying to live a Christian life and do good?